7x07 Discussion / 2:00pm - 3:00pm

24nut · 2009-02-09 22:55:13

Thought i would open the discussion for episode 7, been a real long day today, but as soon as 24 started, it all seemed worth it. Episode 7 was really good.

I see this episode as a transission episode, the plot shifts whithin this hour, the first husband, finds himself in more trouble again, which i guess we'll see how that pans out in the next hour.

I really liked the way Jack, Tony and Bill were all infiltrating the building where Dubaku had his crew, i thought it was great, the only thing i didn't like was the light, the villains hideouts are always too dark ,i know this gives it its air of villainy and darkness, but it was just a little too dark. The action was great and not overdone, they have definatly learnt that action is not everything this season.

In a way im glad the storyline is developing but i kind of didn't want the president involved beacuse the dynamic of "ctu" will now change i guess, but i knew eventually it would change, i really love this tight storylines that keep it personal, i think it keeps the viewing more suspenseful and personal. But they haven't let us down so far and i definatly have faith in the writers.

At the end where Tony said about staying to avoid federal custody, i sure hope we see just as much of tony, im sure we will as they would be mad not to involve Carlos even more than they allready have, but the way jack left it with him was weird. I haven't seen episode 8, i've decided to watch at uk pace for a change, 24 in high definition is a real treat. It definatly is the highlight of the week.

What did everyone else think of the episode?

J_A · 2009-02-09 23:24:27

I saw it last week and loved it, still haven't gotten around to rewatching it. now I realise that you guys have seen it tonight and that I'll have to watch it tomorrow before I get to ep 8 .

i'd just like to comment on one thing there - jack's asking tony to turn himself in.

didn't you think it was very much hypocritical for a guy who's spent the last year of his life running from a federal subpoena to tell tony that? sure, jack may have realised in the meantime that the only way to get rid of his demons was to face them, and it was cute of jack to offer tony to stand behind him - but just remember, jack is not exactly popular with the federal justice system right now. what the hell could he do? call wayne palmer to talk to the AG on Tony's behalf? and as for bill, he's not working for ctu anymore either - he's been working outside the government in an operation funded by who knows who and keeping valuable intel away from the authorities. what - just what - can he do?

besides, when has jack ever had to face any consequences - never. the best he ever got was getting fired from ctu - and that was for heroin, not off-book behaviour. tony, on the other hand, well, we all know how that played out. jack really made me angry there. and then, tony gives him his word - call me an evil writer but with the doubt that was there in tony's eyes as he watched jack walk away with bill, I'm not too sure anymore that he indeed will stay true to his word. I'd still like to believe almeida's word counts for something, but after everything the government has done to him, I don't think he's ready to put himself into the merciless hands of that same government's justice again. after all, the only reason he turned against emerson was that he didn't want innocent lives on his conscience - but I still think that he probably still believes in the things he did against the government since michelle's death. this is a very intriguing development in tony's character, so the real question is,

Will Almeida stay god - or end up a fallen angel?

I'm seeing both possibilities as feasible - either tony will keep his word and turn himself in (which would have been true of a season 3 almeida - before everything) or he won't. if he doesn't, we'll have jack hunting tony down and them indeed working against each other. which in turn could end with tony dying or facing federal charges yet again - and will the writers repeat that treason charge storyline once more? I'm guessing not. since Tony's cover has been blown and he can't go back to work with the baddies, and he also can't go to work with the government directly cause he'd be arrested, he will continue to work independently. now, we all know what usually happens if tony is alone in the field without jack... I'm expecting that lead he's working on to go cold, tony to be captured by john voight's character whom we haven't seen yet but who's bound to appear pretty soon since dubaku is almost out of the picture, and well... everything is possible from there.

the only way tony is getting out of this is if he does something so good and so big that he actually finds redemption, and the new president - who has no prior relationship to jack bauer or bill buchanan or tony almeida for that matter - will spare him the trial.

however, whether this president would be willing to do that remains to be seen. she has been casted as a president who was supposed to be more david palmer-like - having that greatness and presidential guts - and she does. but the first time she's ever heard of almeida was today - as an already pardoned traitor who's "orchestrated attacks" on US soil. of course, she'll learn within the hour that it was also him who helped stop them, but whatever "pretty bad things" tony had done with Emerson seem to be bad enough for the pres to have every reason to arrest him and put him on trial again.

so the season continues with more pain in store for tony and more tests for the Brotherhood. I guess we wouldn't have it any other way but the fact that they've got me so far as considering doubting Tony's word speaks volumes. Whatever happens next won't be easy. I'd also really like to know what pretty bad things tony has done, though it hurts to see how low he'd sunk.

deadmanmoz · 2009-02-10 14:05:58

Totally agree with ya JA.

Jack has no right to tell Tony to turn himself in.
I mean if nothing else Tony is an adult, he can do what he wants.
And yeah, jack has no leg to stand on being on the run himself.

What annoyed me abit is how this is Bill/Tony/Chloe's operation and Bill was giving the orders, then Jack comes along, becomes part of the team and starts giving the orders and they all listen.

J_A · 2009-02-10 14:31:06

deadmanmoz wrote:

What annoyed me abit is how this is Bill/Tony/Chloe's operation and Bill was giving the orders, then Jack comes along, becomes part of the team and starts giving the orders and they all listen.

well, I don't think jack was giving the orders in ep 7 (though I still need to rewatch that) but after seeing ep 8 you're exactly right there. I was thinking that same thing. Cause suddenly Jack calls all the shots again. I think it's pretty much because Jack is the only field ops person in DEEPSKY and bill might have learned through the years (as have others) that jack's usually right - so he's kinda given the right to call the shots. also, this is not ctu any longer james, so remember no-one actually has the right to give orders. just because bill was overseeing the operation doesn't make him the boss - cause he doesn't pay their salaries

Steveb · 2009-02-10 23:04:55

jack_addict wrote:

just because bill was overseeing the operation doesn't make him the boss - cause he doesn't pay their salaries

Which begs the question who does?

A strange episode in many ways. Given it was the first major action-based episode of the season I was left a little downbeat. The shoot-out was excellent and the plot was driven on, however, it did feel a bit season five-ish in the drawing of a line under one set of events and moving to the next.

Obviously Jack and Tony continue to be the major focus but less adamantly I think, as if the producers deliberately aimed episodes 1-5 at them so as to give us chance to get used to the new blood. The FBI- in particular Janice- were given a major chance to shine and credit to Janeane Garafolo, however, would the scene not have been exactly the same had they used Chloe at CTU? Possibly. It just all feels a little too familiar with the government branch.

The Presidential side of things however is getting better. Yes, it's also familiar territory but it's being approached as if it isn't. The writers and producers have clearly decided that even if they don't surprise the audience, it's better to make us think they will. And rightly so.

24roxmysox3 · 2009-02-11 04:35:39

i would be SO MAD if they got all our hopes up by thinking that tony was good and then like all of a sudden he really is bad and its all just been a big game...that would make me SO angery!

J_A · 2009-02-11 10:39:33

Steveb wrote:

Which begs the question who does?

no idea, steve... the CTU pension fund?

A strange episode in many ways. Given it was the first major action-based episode of the season I was left a little downbeat.

Yes, I can see where you're coming from and I agree. We'd gotten so used to strong episodes with lots of great moments that suddenly, a purely action-packed ep feels like a return to another territory. I know we do have to have episodes that advance the plot, but with the balance between characterization and plot that we've hitherto had, maybe we've been spoiled a little. However, the action sequences were excellent - and I have to give Bill credit . For all we know (and according to his profile) he has no military background - but he's no worse in the field than jack with his special forces background and tony with his USMC training.

as for mozz's comment of jack calling the shots, I remembered one quote that pretty much settles that. Jack to Kim, season 3:

"In the field, I am in command."

All clear? .

The shoot-out was excellent and the plot was driven on, however, it did feel a bit season five-ish in the drawing of a line under one set of events and moving to the next...
Obviously Jack and Tony continue to be the major focus but less adamantly I think, as if the producers deliberately aimed episodes 1-5 at them so as to give us chance to get used to the new blood.

I do not remember much of season 5 or 6 for that matter, but you're right as far as that goes. frankly, I am quite surprised that the major plotlines have pretty much been wrapped up now. my fear is that the writers have given us all this good stuff to bring us back on board, and now that we're pulled in (and supposedly cannot leave again) it's not said that things will continue as strongly. although carlos does keep saying in interviews that the strike and the stop n go has enabled them to make every episode strong - and I am willing to believe him. whatever plotlines are coming up, they'd better make sense !

would the scene not have been exactly the same had they used Chloe at CTU? Possibly. It just all feels a little too familiar with the government branch.

Yes, it does. I've actually said in my very first review of the first 17 minutes that CTU has simply been swapped for the FBI - we have the same kind of characters, the only thing they don't have is Field Ops, but somehow they still have available agents out there... One thing that's less clear is the hierarchy. at CTU, it was quite clear who's director, who's #2, who's heading Field Ops, Comm etc etc. here at the FBI, I'm just really not sure who's Larry's #2, is it Renée? Is it Janis? Is Janis Sean's superior? Those are my feelings but it's a bit of guesswork there.

The Presidential side of things however is getting better.

and I think it will continue to do so. I have the feeling that the Tony/Jack stuff has been exploited as far as the writers go, I hope it hasn't, cause there's a lot to work with still, but it's possible that from now on, the plot will be more important, now that they have introduced and built the characters. Frankly, I hope they will find the right balance between both, cause the beginning of this season really sounded like, "Ok, people, we remember now that characterization is what makes the show stronger, and we're moving away from "on with the plot, characters bedamned" kind of writing." So let's hope that the post-strike episodes (starting from ep 9) will continue to be in the same vein.

J_A · 2009-02-11 10:49:09

24roxmysox3 wrote:

i would be SO MAD if they got all our hopes up by thinking that tony was good and then like all of a sudden he really is bad and its all just been a big game...that would make me SO angery!

no,i don't think so. the first idea for the season was to make tony THE villain for S7, but they changed their minds. though I guess it's still possible to turn him. now THAT would be an unexpected twist. but honestly, it would go against tony's character. what they've done so far fits, take it any further (i.e. make tony REALLY willing to take innocent lives) and I walk. cause it's crossing the line

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#1 2009-02-09 22:55:13

7x07 Discussion / 2:00pm - 3:00pm

#2 2009-02-09 23:24:27

Re: 7x07 Discussion / 2:00pm - 3:00pm

#3 2009-02-10 14:05:58

Re: 7x07 Discussion / 2:00pm - 3:00pm

#4 2009-02-10 14:31:06

Re: 7x07 Discussion / 2:00pm - 3:00pm

#5 2009-02-10 23:04:55

Re: 7x07 Discussion / 2:00pm - 3:00pm

#6 2009-02-11 04:35:39

Re: 7x07 Discussion / 2:00pm - 3:00pm

#7 2009-02-11 10:39:33

Re: 7x07 Discussion / 2:00pm - 3:00pm

#8 2009-02-11 10:49:09

Re: 7x07 Discussion / 2:00pm - 3:00pm

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